Hallo,
I am a foreign student studying in Germany. In feb 2008 I browsed through a website called Modelstyle (website link provided below). I was in search of some small jobs, so I decided to try my luck in modelling. as the website said there are no monthly fees or annual fees and a fee of 49€ is payable only when they are looking for models in my region I decided to join it assuming I would have an option to accept or decline the membership when they contact with some offer. following is the german text of the condition.
'Die Allgemeinen Geschäftsbedingungen und die Datenschutzerklärung habe ich gelesen und akzeptiere diese. Modelstyle erhebt keine Monats- oder Jahresgebühren. Nur falls wir Dich bei uns aufnehmen oder aktuell Models in Deiner Region suchen, wird ein einmaliger Betrag von neunundvierzig Euro (inkl. 19% MwSt.) für die Anmeldung fällig.'
the link to the website is http://www.modelstyle.com/anmeldung.php
After 2 weeks I recieved a letter from Mediafinancz (http://www.mediafinanz.de/) on behalf of modelstyle to pay 49€. As there was job offer along with it, I ignored it. The second letter came when I was back in my homecountry for a short vacation. The letter imposed a fine of 49€ for delayed payment and totalled the payable amount to 98€. I very recently recieved a third letter stating if I dont pay the amount , a case will be filed in the court and the charges will have to be borne by me. In sheer desperation I called up mediafinanz, however a very rude lady stressed that I have to pay the money and there is no such condition on the website that states the money is payable when they offer an assignment.
I am not sure how seriously to take this. I am broke at the moment and cannot afford to pay 49€ leave alone 98€ nor can I afford to pay additional court charges. Can someone please suggest a way forward. thanks in advance.
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Scammed by Modelstyle.com - a model agency website
Am I obliged to pay, how can I get out of this?
A simple online search would have told you that this is a scam: Google - modelstyle betrug
Tell them you have been in touch with a lawyer and he says you do not have to pay.In future do not sign up for anything you are not sure about.
have you signed anything ? in my somewhat limited knowledge of law, unless you sign something that states you are entering a legally binding contract no one can just demand monies from you, end of story !
if you have indeed not signed anything you dont have to pay a god damn cent, tell em to shove it up there asses !
if you have indeed not signed anything you dont have to pay a god damn cent, tell em to shove it up there asses !
Awful advice. You don't need to "sign" anything. Ticking a box on an online form is sufficient.
See the following thread for better advice:
Dodgy websites that send bills after you register.
But actually, it's fairly clear that a fee was going to be charged:
In other words, if they accept you (which of course they will), then they will charge you.
No, that's not what it says. It says "Only if we accept you OR if models are sought in your region" will a charge be levied. They accepted you. You pay them.
See the following thread for better advice:
Dodgy websites that send bills after you register.
But actually, it's fairly clear that a fee was going to be charged:
QUOTE
'Die Allgemeinen Geschäftsbedingungen und die Datenschutzerklärung habe ich gelesen und akzeptiere diese. Modelstyle erhebt keine Monats- oder Jahresgebühren. Nur falls wir Dich bei uns aufnehmen oder aktuell Models in Deiner Region suchen, wird ein einmaliger Betrag von neunundvierzig Euro (inkl. 19% MwSt.) für die Anmeldung fällig.'
In other words, if they accept you (which of course they will), then they will charge you.
QUOTE (playsafe @ Jul 10 2008, 11:19 pm) 
a fee of 49€ is payable only when they are looking for models in my region
No, that's not what it says. It says "Only if we accept you OR if models are sought in your region" will a charge be levied. They accepted you. You pay them.
QUOTE (ThunderCat @ Jul 11 2008, 3:40 pm)
if you have indeed not signed anything you dont have to pay a god damn cent
Not really.
Ignore Small_Town_Boy. Whenever somebody gets caught by this kind of scam, he's always there telling you, you have to pay, and telling you to read the conditions.
The rest of the advice is good, as is my advice to ingore this person who's motivation, we really don't understand
The rest of the advice is good, as is my advice to ingore this person who's motivation, we really don't understand
Hi Playsafe --
Look up the Verbraucherschutz and make an appointment with them. It'll cost euro 15 but they will act as your attorney in this kind of thing and probably get you out of it.
Look up the Verbraucherschutz and make an appointment with them. It'll cost euro 15 but they will act as your attorney in this kind of thing and probably get you out of it.
If you can read German you may find this site helpful. There are even links to the letter that you should send to them as refusal to pay.
There is no clear statement on the form that you will be charged something and according to all Verbraucherschutz regulations you are not obliged to pay. Since you were not "aufgenommen" into their agency, I suspect this is fraud.
There is no clear statement on the form that you will be charged something and according to all Verbraucherschutz regulations you are not obliged to pay. Since you were not "aufgenommen" into their agency, I suspect this is fraud.
Contact details of the consumer advice centre in Stuttgart: Verbraucherzentrale Baden-Württemberg e. V., Paulinenstr. 47,
70178 Stuttgart, Tel: 0711 66 91 10 http://www.vz-bawue.de/UNIQ121578687414805/link1A.html
The following is from the Hamburg "Verbraucherzentrale" (http://www.vzhh.de/) (found by typing "Inkasso" into the search box):
70178 Stuttgart, Tel: 0711 66 91 10 http://www.vz-bawue.de/UNIQ121578687414805/link1A.html
The following is from the Hamburg "Verbraucherzentrale" (http://www.vzhh.de/) (found by typing "Inkasso" into the search box):
QUOTE
Es kommt immer öfter vor, dass betrügerische oder unseriöse Firmen einfach behaupten, Sie würden ihnen Geld schulden. Oft wurde auch ein (angeblicher) Vertrag, z.B. beim Surfen im Internet, untergeschoben. Der unseriöse Anbieter weiß, dass viele Leute sich von Inkassobriefen einschüchtern lassen und zahlen, obwohl sie es nicht müssten.
Inkassoinstitute prüfen nicht, ob die Forderung überhaupt besteht! Es interessiert sie auch gar nicht. Von jedem Euro, der eingezahlt wird, bekommen sie einen bestimmten Prozentsatz. Je mehr und je öfter gedroht wird, desto mehr Geld fließt in die Kasse.
Wird die Forderung nicht bezahlt, kann das Inkassoinstitut gar nichts machen - außer immer wüstere Drohbriefe schreiben. Es kann insbesondere nicht einen Gerichtsvollzieher in Marsch setzen, eine Pfändung veranlassen oder Sie ins Gefängnis bringen. Es sind alles nur theoretische Drohungen.
"Haft" zum Beispiel kann nur beantragt werden, wenn der Gläubiger einen Titel hat, und die Forderung nicht bezahlt wird und eine Vollstreckung vergeblich ist und der Schuldner zur Abgabe der eidesstattlichen Versicherung aufgefordert wird und der Schuldner die Abgabe dieser Erklärung grundlos verweigert.
Für jede Form der Vollstreckung müsste der Gläubiger bzw. das Inkassoinstitut sich erst einen "Titel" besorgen, also einen gerichtlichen Vollstreckungsbescheid oder ein Urteil. Im Laufe eines solchen Verfahrens (Mahnverfahren oder Klage) haben Sie mehrfach Gelegenheit vorzutragen, dass die Forderung haltlos ist. Weil der Gläubiger das genau weiß, wird er nicht vor Gericht ziehen. Die Sache verläuft also irgendwann im Sande, wenn Sie einfach stur bleiben.
Reagieren müssen Sie nur (dann aber sehr zügig), wenn ein gerichtlicher Mahnbescheid kommt.
· wenn es sein könnte, dass die Forderung zu Recht besteht:
Natürlich sollte sie dann bezahlt werden. Wenn man nicht genug Geld hat, sollte eine Ratenzahlung vereinbart werden. Aber: Damit Sie dabei nicht über den Tisch gezogen werden, gehen Sie auf jeden Fall zur Rechtsberatung der Verbraucherzentrale. Hier wird geklärt, ob die Forderung wirklich rechtens ist. Und: Fast immer sind die Inkassokosten zu hoch angesetzt! Unberechtigte Inkassokosten müssen nicht bezahlt werden, auch, wenn die eigentliche Forderung stimmt.
Inkassoinstitute prüfen nicht, ob die Forderung überhaupt besteht! Es interessiert sie auch gar nicht. Von jedem Euro, der eingezahlt wird, bekommen sie einen bestimmten Prozentsatz. Je mehr und je öfter gedroht wird, desto mehr Geld fließt in die Kasse.
Wird die Forderung nicht bezahlt, kann das Inkassoinstitut gar nichts machen - außer immer wüstere Drohbriefe schreiben. Es kann insbesondere nicht einen Gerichtsvollzieher in Marsch setzen, eine Pfändung veranlassen oder Sie ins Gefängnis bringen. Es sind alles nur theoretische Drohungen.
"Haft" zum Beispiel kann nur beantragt werden, wenn der Gläubiger einen Titel hat, und die Forderung nicht bezahlt wird und eine Vollstreckung vergeblich ist und der Schuldner zur Abgabe der eidesstattlichen Versicherung aufgefordert wird und der Schuldner die Abgabe dieser Erklärung grundlos verweigert.
Für jede Form der Vollstreckung müsste der Gläubiger bzw. das Inkassoinstitut sich erst einen "Titel" besorgen, also einen gerichtlichen Vollstreckungsbescheid oder ein Urteil. Im Laufe eines solchen Verfahrens (Mahnverfahren oder Klage) haben Sie mehrfach Gelegenheit vorzutragen, dass die Forderung haltlos ist. Weil der Gläubiger das genau weiß, wird er nicht vor Gericht ziehen. Die Sache verläuft also irgendwann im Sande, wenn Sie einfach stur bleiben.
Reagieren müssen Sie nur (dann aber sehr zügig), wenn ein gerichtlicher Mahnbescheid kommt.
· wenn es sein könnte, dass die Forderung zu Recht besteht:
Natürlich sollte sie dann bezahlt werden. Wenn man nicht genug Geld hat, sollte eine Ratenzahlung vereinbart werden. Aber: Damit Sie dabei nicht über den Tisch gezogen werden, gehen Sie auf jeden Fall zur Rechtsberatung der Verbraucherzentrale. Hier wird geklärt, ob die Forderung wirklich rechtens ist. Und: Fast immer sind die Inkassokosten zu hoch angesetzt! Unberechtigte Inkassokosten müssen nicht bezahlt werden, auch, wenn die eigentliche Forderung stimmt.
No, this is different from the more general dubious websites discussed in the thread I linked to above. Those are fly-by-night operations based in the UK for legal reasons. This modelling agency is Germany-based and is 13 years old, by their own account. The OP applied to be on their books, and was accepted. For this, she has to pay a fee. In theory, she may actually get some work through this, although I wouldn't bank on it in practice.
I don't have any "motivation" in telling people to pay, but in this instance the conditions are clear. If you apply and are accepted, then you pay a fee. The OP applied was accepted. I don't know on what MoiLV is basing her assertion that the OP wasn't accepted. You can't just cry "scam" every time a company charges you money.
The point I would make in favour of the OP is that a 100% surcharge for late payment is excessive. If she contacts them and makes up some excuse, they may be prepared to reduce it or even waive it. But the €49 stands, because as far as I can see it's a genuine agency, even if they do take the €49 off people who in reality stand little chance of getting any work.
Read the reviews of the website on Ciao. Lots of people who paid the money but never got any work, but also reviews from people who did get work through the website. I agree that it would be fairer if they only charged you once you received work, but they're not obliged to do that and they make clear that this is not how it works.
I don't have any "motivation" in telling people to pay, but in this instance the conditions are clear. If you apply and are accepted, then you pay a fee. The OP applied was accepted. I don't know on what MoiLV is basing her assertion that the OP wasn't accepted. You can't just cry "scam" every time a company charges you money.
The point I would make in favour of the OP is that a 100% surcharge for late payment is excessive. If she contacts them and makes up some excuse, they may be prepared to reduce it or even waive it. But the €49 stands, because as far as I can see it's a genuine agency, even if they do take the €49 off people who in reality stand little chance of getting any work.
Read the reviews of the website on Ciao. Lots of people who paid the money but never got any work, but also reviews from people who did get work through the website. I agree that it would be fairer if they only charged you once you received work, but they're not obliged to do that and they make clear that this is not how it works.
so then small town boy, if i had your address and name i could sign you upto this agency and have you a bill sent out, even though you had no idea when what or where this had come from, so anyone could sign anyone else up in that case, what a load of old crap, if you havent signed anything your not legally obliged to pay anything at all whatsoever ! and thats the top and bottom of it, tell em to fuck off ! and you have never heard of them or there stupid rip off company.
for instance, i ended my mobile phone contract last september, i ended the contract, i then payed the final sum(which i have the reciept for), suddenly out of the blue 6 months later yes SIX months...i get a bill for 300 £ , i go to my lawyer, he says because i havent opted to continue this contract i can sue THEM under the Harassment act 1977, these people sent me bailiffs letters demanding payment, they sent me red letters, all sorts of threats about doing things to my credit reputation etc etc.. you name it, stand strong, dont take any notice of them, just tell them to shove it !
for instance, i ended my mobile phone contract last september, i ended the contract, i then payed the final sum(which i have the reciept for), suddenly out of the blue 6 months later yes SIX months...i get a bill for 300 £ , i go to my lawyer, he says because i havent opted to continue this contract i can sue THEM under the Harassment act 1977, these people sent me bailiffs letters demanding payment, they sent me red letters, all sorts of threats about doing things to my credit reputation etc etc.. you name it, stand strong, dont take any notice of them, just tell them to shove it !
No, TC, the only problem would be if you signed up using STB's internet connection. Otherwise they would eventually be able to trace it back to you (or anyway, to someone else than STB). BUT it is very possible that the way this modeling site's sign-up page is not fulfilling legal requirements despite the company existing for 13 years. Go to the Verbraucherzentrale, if they are a fraud, they probably already know about it.
My two cents worth is that i would tend to agree with STB , it was clealy written what the agency was about . Having said that , i´m fairly sure that a 49 euro surcharge IS illegal , and i would certainly challenge having to pay that .
Tc , you can´t always compare English law with German law . Maybe you are not doing that , but your profile has you down as being in the U.K.
Tc , you can´t always compare English law with German law . Maybe you are not doing that , but your profile has you down as being in the U.K.
QUOTE (Mariposa @ Jul 11 2008, 8:44 pm)
No, TC, the only problem would be if you signed up using STB's internet connection.
The old "we have your IP address" doesn't work, as far as I can remember. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the German courts decided against the compulsory saving of IP addresses (from the internet provider's side.)
May be way too simple: Decline that you signed up in the first place.
Or did you send in a passport copy?
No DA (Staatsanwalt) will start an investigation because of a 49 Euros civil claim.
Or did you send in a passport copy?
No DA (Staatsanwalt) will start an investigation because of a 49 Euros civil claim.
Dear All,
Thanks for responding and offering your advice. it has been really very helpful. before deciding on what to do, I have a small question to u STB
@ STB
you pointed 'Nur falls wir Dich bei uns aufnehmen ' implies I am supposed to pay if they accept me...why woudnt they? they would even accept a dog if they would get money. But the second part of that line says 'oder aktuell Models in Deiner Region suchen' which implies I am supposed to pay registration charges if they accept me or if they are searching models in my region. which implies the registration will take place not when i click on the website but later when they offer acceptance and me agreeing to it...cannot the case be argued based on this?
'Die Allgemeinen Geschäftsbedingungen und die Datenschutzerklärung habe ich gelesen und akzeptiere diese. Modelstyle erhebt keine Monats- oder Jahresgebühren. Nur falls wir Dich bei uns aufnehmen oder aktuell Models in Deiner Region suchen, wird ein einmaliger Betrag von neunundvierzig Euro (inkl. 19% MwSt.) für die Anmeldung fällig.'
Thanks for responding and offering your advice. it has been really very helpful. before deciding on what to do, I have a small question to u STB
@ STB
you pointed 'Nur falls wir Dich bei uns aufnehmen ' implies I am supposed to pay if they accept me...why woudnt they? they would even accept a dog if they would get money. But the second part of that line says 'oder aktuell Models in Deiner Region suchen' which implies I am supposed to pay registration charges if they accept me or if they are searching models in my region. which implies the registration will take place not when i click on the website but later when they offer acceptance and me agreeing to it...cannot the case be argued based on this?
'Die Allgemeinen Geschäftsbedingungen und die Datenschutzerklärung habe ich gelesen und akzeptiere diese. Modelstyle erhebt keine Monats- oder Jahresgebühren. Nur falls wir Dich bei uns aufnehmen oder aktuell Models in Deiner Region suchen, wird ein einmaliger Betrag von neunundvierzig Euro (inkl. 19% MwSt.) für die Anmeldung fällig.'
Simply dont pay. it cost them 5 times more to actually take it legally (which they wont, and its illegal for them to even threaten you with that, under german law)...then they arent even ensured successful litigation. Its an online scam and you arent responsible for paying anything.
oder = or
if they accept OR if they're looking for models ...
It's a scam, you fell for it. Go to the verbraucherzentrale and get out of it.
if they accept OR if they're looking for models ...
It's a scam, you fell for it. Go to the verbraucherzentrale and get out of it.
As you say, it's pretty unlikely that they wouldn't accept you, because it's not in their financial interest to reject you. However, I view that online form as an application, which they then accept or reject. I don't see anything about another stage where they offer you a contract that you can accept or reject. My interpretation of their AGBs is exactly that:
In other words, by submitting the registration form, you are submitting an application for a contract, which the company will then either accept or reject.
Take the advice of the users here and talk to the Verbraucherzentrale; they know far more than me. Whatever happens, good luck and keep us posted.
QUOTE
Durch Absenden der Anmeldung gibt das Model ein Vertragsangebot im Sinne des § 145 BGB ab. Der Vertrag kommt mit einer Annahme in Textform (z. B. Brief, Fax, Email) durch Modelstyle innerhalb einer Frist von 14 Tagen nach Anmeldung zustande. Erfolgt keine Annahmeerklärung durch Modelstyle, wird kein Vertrag geschlossen.
In other words, by submitting the registration form, you are submitting an application for a contract, which the company will then either accept or reject.
Take the advice of the users here and talk to the Verbraucherzentrale; they know far more than me. Whatever happens, good luck and keep us posted.
QUOTE (Chat_Capone @ Jul 14 2008, 4:40 pm)
Simply dont pay. it cost them 5 times more to actually take it legally (which they wont, and its illegal for them to even threaten you with that, under german law)...then they arent even ensured successful litigation. Its an online scam and you arent responsible for paying anything.
This is unbelievably bad advice. It costs around €50 to submit a claim for payment default to the German court. This is sufficient to engage court bailiffs to recover the alleged debt and start racking up additional costs, which if the defendant loses in defense can be substantial. Their Terms and Conditions look watertight and binding and calling them a publicly "scam" may even be libellous. Whether they are fair in content or application is another matter and not directly related to the outstanding debt, which until these terms are proved otherwise is valid. One should always read and understand the terms of a contract before signing up.
Of course, one should always read the terms and conditions of a contract. But it's very easy to get tricked as I know from personal expereince. You're not an idiot for falling for such tricks. I hope the Verbraucherzentrale can help you. If it was my money there's no way I'd pay. I'd fight them all the way. Good luck
I can only advise everyone to read the information available carefully before signing anything. Even a simple signature when receiving registered mail can get you a "nice" contract with Tele2 - they used what is called the PostIdent method (allows the use of a "personalized document" for signing, i.e. said contract ).
With modelstyle, I would advise not to pay. While you did "sign" a contract, they did not fullfill their part - there was no checking of your application, they did not provide you with a full setcard...that will at least give the judge sth to think about, IF this goes to court...and according to most of the reports I've read, it hardly ever does ;-)
With modelstyle, I would advise not to pay. While you did "sign" a contract, they did not fullfill their part - there was no checking of your application, they did not provide you with a full setcard...that will at least give the judge sth to think about, IF this goes to court...and according to most of the reports I've read, it hardly ever does ;-)
QUOTE (sweetsilence @ Jul 15 2008, 9:37 pm)
While you did "sign" a contract, they did not fullfill their part -
Yes they did. They showed "intent" to hire her, which fullfiled their contractual obligations and requires payment.
QUOTE (Small Town Boy @ Jul 14 2008, 6:09 pm)
Take the advice of the users here and talk to the Verbraucherzentrale; they know far more than me.
I'd advice this as well as the site does not look like a scam. A typical scam site would be registered to an overseas address normally just a postbox address; lots of dodgy websites would be associated with the same address; the site will have be at the most a year old. This site does not fulfil any of these criteria plus the German postal address of this website produces fairly respectable looking companies.
For those who say you should not pay you should also ask them if they would be willing to pay towards your fine.
Whether the site is breaking any law only the Verbraucherzentrale would be able to confirm.
QUOTE
For those who say you should not pay you should also ask them if they would be willing to pay towards your fine.
As previously stated if it were my money I wouldn't pay. Don't forget it's a scam. These scams try to scare people into paying bills. You can roll over on your back and pay or fight, the choice is yours.
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